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Poster: samson Date: May 14, 2006 12:59pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: new format?

Hey now, if you go to the top of the page to the "search" feature click on advanced.It should take you to this page...

http://www.archive.org/advancedsearch.php

Under creator type in band name...lets say Grateful Dead. Next go to Date range and type in a year...1972! Range is from 01-01 to 12-31 and type in enter and you get every show on the archive for that year. If thats too much then click on "date" under the "sort by date"ption and you get this in descending order...
http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=date%3A%5B1972-01-01%20TO%201972-12-31%5D&sort=-%2Fmetadata%2Fdate

Not so tough.

Its not too bad. Takes some getting used to but it is for the best. Good luck!

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Poster: Hatta Date: May 15, 2006 12:16am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: new format?

What if you don't know which years a band has played? What if you want to see which years are best(or worst) represented on the archive and listen to those? What if you want to see the source of a show without clicking through every single show in a given year?

It IS tough, and it IS bad. Anyone who can't see this just wasn't using the old interface to its full potential.

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Poster: rainydaybloke Date: May 14, 2006 4:41pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: new format?

samson said:
Hey now, if you go to the top of the page to the "search" feature click on advanced.It should take you to this page...

http://www.archive.org/advancedsearch.php

Under creator type in band name...lets say Grateful Dead...
-------------------------------------

I went to that page to search for any soundboard recordings by the Mekons. First I typed "mekons" in the Creator field, then typed "sbd OR soundboard" in the Description field (no quote marks were used in the fields). I used this OR search after reading how the search engine works further down the page.

Then I hit "Search" and up popped this result:
"Your search did not match any items in the Archive."

I know that is wrong. Here is one of a few Mekons soundboard shows:
http://www.archive.org/details/mek2004-03-23.shnf
The term SBD is on the fifth line!

So I tried again and put "soundboard OR sbd" in the "Any field" field. And it worked!! 20 results!!
This is going to take a lot of trial and error.

I've gotta say though, the programmers have not bent over backwards to make it easy for users. For example on the front page under Recently Reviewed Items there are five shows. Three of them don't tell us who the artist/creator is. It's all just "Live at ..." and a date. Same problem in Top Batting Averages and Most Downloaded Items. This problem should be taken care of immediately.

While writing the previous paragraph I went to the front page and found it was not possible to copy the list of Recently Reviewed Items. This also happened on other pages recently. Do we have to select ALL the text on a page in order to copy a few lines? That is not user-friendly at all.

Note: I'm offering criticism hoping it will be taken as constructive.

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Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffDiana Hamilton Date: May 14, 2006 11:15pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: new format?

[search stuff] This is going to take a lot of trial and error.

Right, a lot of the search aspects are way less intuitive (like, many metadata fields are searchable, but how do we know what values they accept? How do we know that the 5th line that says "SBD" is *not* actually in the Description field, but a separate Source field?) I'm hoping there can be some detailed docs sometime so I can RTFM, though it probably won't appear in the short term. This is a sitewide issue.

Recently Reviewed Items there are five shows. Three of them don't tell us who the artist/creator is. It's all just "Live at ..." and a date. Same problem in Top Batting Averages and Most Downloaded Items. This problem should be taken care of immediately.

This is toward the top of engineers' bugfix list right now.


This post was modified by Diana Hamilton on 2006-05-15 06:15:11

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Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffDiana Hamilton Date: May 14, 2006 11:02pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: new format?

One way to skip the sometimes-daunting Advanced Search pagge for just a band/year search is: On the main LMA page, click the "Visit Artist Collection Pages" link, browse to name, enter year in the box on the resulting page, hit GO.

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Poster: Dancing Salmon Date: May 14, 2006 2:49pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: new format?

Under creator type in band name...lets say Grateful Dead. Next go to Date range and type in a year...1972! Range is from 01-01 to 12-31 and type in enter and you get every show on the archive for that year. If thats too much then click on "date" under the "sort by date"ption and you get this in descending order...
http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=date%3A%5B1972-01-01%20TO%201972-12-31%5D&sort=-%2Fmetadata%2Fdate


The page you reference is a perfect example of the problems people have with this new system. Compare it to the equivalent old style page --
http://www.archive.org/audio/etreelisting-browse.php?collection=etree&cat=Grateful%20Dead%3A%201972

Apart from the annoyance that descending order just seems wrong, and the prettier display in the old style, there is a serious, not cosmetic, deficiency in the new page relative to the old. That is the lack of recording info. For instance, in the page you cite, there are two recordings for each of 09-28, 09-26 and 09-24 (and probably others), with no indication of how they differ -- sbd/aud? mics? processing? That was immediately obvious a few days ago, and now you have to jump back and forth or open numerous windows to see what's what. Maybe you're looking for AUDs since SBDs aren't downloadable. Or maybe you hate aud tapes, or want one of those sweet Charlie Miller masterings, or .... Maybe this can all be done with the search engine, if you know exactly what you want (and have a CS degree), but it feels kind of like we used to be able to wander around in the stacks at a library, and now we have to request books by call number.

Diana, I think, explained a bit of what drives the new format, but I hope some of the old functionality can be returned.

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Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffDiana Hamilton Date: May 14, 2006 9:51pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: new format?

there is a serious, not cosmetic, deficiency in the new page relative to the old. That is the lack of recording info.

This is already on a list of feature req's for consideration.

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Poster: Dancing Salmon Date: May 14, 2006 10:00pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: new format?

Thanks, Diana. I'm aware that y'all are aware of this one, and pleased to see it's "on the list". I was just talking back to Samson, who seemed to think the page he referenced was just a minor re-casting of the page I pointered to. I appreciate that you guys are taking our "suggestions" (however intemperately phrased) to heart and are working on them. There's really only a handful of substantive issues that reduce functionality, that are hard to just "get used to", and for me this is the major one. I also realize it's one that will take some serious coding, as opposed to tweaking.

I also noticed seriously improved download speed. I see Brad's plan to "weed out the lightweights" has been working. It couldn't have had anything to do with moving to the Petabox (sp?) ;-).

Thanks for all the work, and for maintaining your calm in the face of some screechy posts.
-DS